Based on Mark B Spiegel, Montana Skeptic and some other short seller tweets on Twitter it is very obvious that they are the ones who are in desperate position here and are "crying fraud" where is none. They are massively underwater with their TSLA short position.

Feel sorry for you, Mish, that you have fallen for their propoganda and have converted Mish Talk as a medium for them to amplify their message in one sided manner.

Since Tesla has been on hiring spree for the last years, then it is not fair to compare nominal 2016 and 2018 "Executive Departure Count" numbers. You would have to normalize those numbers over total executives working at Tesla that year. And even then you can't distuinguish the case whether executive departures mean that Tesla is "trimming down the fat" or whether those departures mean that something shady is going on at Tesla and "rats are fleeing a sinking ship".

When you repost tweets from Mark B Spiegel I think it would be fair for you to put a disclosure for your readers that he is short TSLA. Some of your readers may not know that.

P.S. For full disclosure I am long Tesla.

Wagner_4 said (edited): Based on Mark B Spiegel, Montana Skeptic and some other short seller tweets on Twitter it is very obvious that they are the ones who are in desperate position here and are "crying fraud" where is none. They are massively underwater with their TSLA short position. Feel sorry for you, Mish, that you have fallen for their propoganda and have converted Mish Talk as a medium for them to amplify their message in one sided manner. Since Tesla has been on hiring spree for the last years, then it is not fair to compare nominal 2016 and 2018 "Executive Departure Count" numbers. You would have to normalize those numbers over total executives working at Tesla that year. And even then you can't distuinguish the case whether executive departures mean that Tesla is "trimming down the fat" or whether those departures mean that something shady is going on at Tesla and "rats are fleeing a sinking ship". When you repost tweets from Mark B Spiegel I think it would be fair for you to put a disclosure for your readers that he is short TSLA. Some of your readers may not know that. P.S. For full disclosure I am long Tesla.

I think he covered those short at a loss and now has PUTs - Yikes - No position here

Wagner_4 said (edited): Based on Mark B Spiegel, Montana Skeptic and some other short seller tweets on Twitter it is very obvious that they are the ones who are in desperate position here and are "crying fraud" where is none. They are massively underwater with their TSLA short position. Feel sorry for you, Mish, that you have fallen for their propoganda and have converted Mish Talk as a medium for them to amplify their message in one sided manner. Since Tesla has been on hiring spree for the last years, then it is not fair to compare nominal 2016 and 2018 "Executive Departure Count" numbers. You would have to normalize those numbers over total executives working at Tesla that year. And even then you can't distuinguish the case whether executive departures mean that Tesla is "trimming down the fat" or whether those departures mean that something shady is going on at Tesla and "rats are fleeing a sinking ship". When you repost tweets from Mark B Spiegel I think it would be fair for you to put a disclosure for your readers that he is short TSLA. Some of your readers may not know that. P.S. For full disclosure I am long Tesla.

Once Musk began blaming short sellers the writing was on the wall. There is no bigger red flag. His latest missive blaming "sabotage" and just yesterday suing a whistleblower for espionage only confirmed it.

Wagner_4 said (edited): Based on Mark B Spiegel, Montana Skeptic and some other short seller tweets on Twitter it is very obvious that they are the ones who are in desperate position here and are "crying fraud" where is none. They are massively underwater with their TSLA short position. Feel sorry for you, Mish, that you have fallen for their propoganda and have converted Mish Talk as a medium for them to amplify their message in one sided manner. Since Tesla has been on hiring spree for the last years, then it is not fair to compare nominal 2016 and 2018 "Executive Departure Count" numbers. You would have to normalize those numbers over total executives working at Tesla that year. And even then you can't distuinguish the case whether executive departures mean that Tesla is "trimming down the fat" or whether those departures mean that something shady is going on at Tesla and "rats are fleeing a sinking ship". When you repost tweets from Mark B Spiegel I think it would be fair for you to put a disclosure for your readers that he is short TSLA. Some of your readers may not know that. P.S. For full disclosure I am long Tesla.

Have read before that you're a true believer. Out of curiosity, do you view Elizabeth Holmes as a wrongfully accused visionary too?

Tengen said: Have read before that you're a true believer. Out of curiosity, do you view Elizabeth Holmes as a wrongfully accused visionary too?

That is one of the most common strawman arguments the shortsellers use; And then anti-establishment sheeps like you repeat.

So I will ask you - what are similarities between Elon Musk anf Elizabeth Holmes?

Did Elizabeth Holmes have company with a comparable product to Falcon Heavy reusable rockets (which have HUGE profits per launch) or Tesla Model S/X (which are by the way profitable EVs if you subtract unrelated to product CapEx and OpEx expenses)?

Wagner_4 said: That is one of the most common strawman arguments the shortsellers use; And then anti-establishment sheeps like you repeat. So I will ask you - what are similarities between Elon Musk anf Elizabeth Holmes? Did Elizabeth Holmes have company with a comparable product to Falcon Heavy reusable rockets (which have HUGE profits per launch) or Tesla Model S/X (which are by the way profitable EVs if you subtract unrelated to product CapEx and OpEx expenses)?

Touched a nerve, did I? I have an automatic distrust of people who promise the sun, moon, and stars to investors, so to me the two sound very similar. They also spend inordinate time on damage control and both like to quarrel with former employees, ostensibly over theft of intellectual property.

Enjoy your long position!

Wagner_4 said: That is one of the most common strawman arguments the shortsellers use; And then anti-establishment sheeps like you repeat. So I will ask you - what are similarities between Elon Musk anf Elizabeth Holmes? Did Elizabeth Holmes have company with a comparable product to Falcon Heavy reusable rockets (which have HUGE profits per launch) or Tesla Model S/X (which are by the way profitable EVs if you subtract unrelated to product CapEx and OpEx expenses)?

What does SpaceX have to do with Tesla's per-unit or per share or per quarter profitability? You are an Elon fanboy with no perspective on the independence of enterprises. As for the similarity with Elizabeth, it has to do with over-promising and under-delivering to the extent that the seller loses credibility. To the degree that the over-promising is repeated, it becomes clear the the seller was not being truthful but instead was pumping a share price. But fanboys will blank this out.

aqualech said: What does SpaceX have to do with Tesla's per-unit or per share or per quarter profitability? You are an Elon fanboy with no perspective on the independence of enterprises. As for the similarity with Elizabeth, it has to do with over-promising and under-delivering to the extent that the seller loses credibility. To the degree that the over-promising is repeated, it becomes clear the the seller was not being truthful but instead was pumping a share price. But fanboys will blank this out.

Tengen was actually the first one who blurred the topic from "Tesla" to "Elon Musk" by mentioning Elizabeth Holmes (ie. implying that there are analogies with her. She was clearly producing vaporware).

I would have happily let the focus stay on Tesla.

The easiest way to refute any claims that Elon Musk is blatant "fraud boy" who promises only vaporware is by mentioning achievments of his SpaceX.

Even Tesla is a good example that it actually eventually delivers on promises. Other big market cap companies in Silicon Valley have missed deadlines and cancelled projects too (eg, Intel was very late with 10nm tech and cancelled Larrabee architecture. Since these are Enterprise techs then average Joe short seller really does not care about Intel overpromising here)

Go check Mark B Spiegel Twitter account if you want to see a desperate bear who has resorted to personal attacks on Elon Musk. He rarely can stay focused on Tesla in his short thesis.

Also, it is too early to accuse Elon Musk of orchestrating pump and dump scheme because he has not dumped his TSLA stock yet. You are predicting as if it is certain already.

Tesla: Zero Emissions and Zero Profits

Tesla is the last reported and plenty of problems.

Consumer Reports 2018 Least Reliable Cars

Consumer Reports each year asks subscribers whether they've had problems with their cars. That data, which this year comes from 640,000 vehicles, forms our a...

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Wagner_4 said (edited): Tengen was actually the first one who blurred the topic from "Tesla" to "Elon Musk" by mentioning Elizabeth Holmes (ie. implying that there are analogies with her. She was clearly producing vaporware). I would have happily let the focus stay on Tesla. The easiest way to refute any claims that Elon Musk is blatant "fraud boy" who promises only vaporware is by mentioning achievments of his SpaceX. Even Tesla is a good example that it actually *eventually* delivers on promises. Other big market cap companies in Silicon Valley have missed deadlines and cancelled projects too (eg, Intel was very late with 10nm tech and cancelled Larrabee architecture. Since these are Enterprise techs then average Joe short seller really does not care about Intel overpromising here) Go check Mark B Spiegel Twitter account if you want to see a desperate bear who has resorted to personal attacks on Elon Musk. He rarely can stay focused on Tesla in his short thesis. Also, it is too early to accuse Elon Musk of orchestrating pump and dump scheme because he has not dumped his TSLA stock yet. You are predicting as if it is certain already.

The SolarCity acquisition by Tesla appears to be a bit of self-dealing by Musk that's going to blow up. Those solar roof tiles he presented? Fake. They're about to announce multiple site closures.

Brian1 said: The SolarCity acquisition by Tesla appears to be a bit of self-dealing by Musk that's going to blow up. Those solar roof tiles he presented? Fake. They're about to announce multiple site closures.

Tesla solar roof tiles are real. There are real customers using them. You are entering conspiracy theory territory by claiming that all those Tesla customers with installed solar roof tiles on their home roofs are paid actors.

As for accusations coming out from "Mark B Spiegel clan" that Elon Musk allegedly was using non-functional solar roof tile mockup in the product announcment? I really don't care as long as Tesla has functional solar roof tile product now (which they do).

FYI: Nokia captured its Lumia 920 (or 1020) promo video that they used in product announcment with professional DSLR camera and some people rightly assumed that it was recorded with the Lumia phone which was supposed to have revolutionary camera. I find this a magnitude more deceiving than what Tesla allegedly did.

As for closing facilities, since Tesla is supply limited and not demand limited, then it makes total sense to cut back on sales folks (and solar roof mounters) who work in those facilities.

Wagner_4 said: Tesla solar roof tiles are real. There are real customers using them. You are entering conspiracy theory territory by claiming that all those Tesla customers with installed solar roof tiles on their home roofs are paid actors. As for accusations coming out from "Mark B Spiegel clan" that Elon Musk allegedly was using non-functional solar roof tile mockup in the product announcment? I really don't care as long as Tesla has functional solar roof tile product now (which they do). FYI: Nokia captured its Lumia 920 (or 1020) promo video that they used in product announcment with professional DSLR camera and some people rightly assumed that it was recorded with the Lumia phone which was supposed to have revolutionary camera. I find this a magnitude more deceiving than what Tesla allegedly did. As for closing facilities, since Tesla is supply limited and not demand limited, then it makes total sense to cut back on sales folks (and solar roof mounters) who work in those facilities.

The roof shingles Musk showed to pitch the SolarCity acq to his shareholders were non-functioning mockups. He neglected to mention that. Even with California mandating and subsidizing hundreds of millions in a taxpayer giveaway to solar, Musk is about to announce the closure of installation centers all over the country. Employees have already leaked the details. SolarCity added billions of their debt to TSLA and Musk was their largest shareholder at the time, bailing himself out.

Brian1 said: The roof shingles Musk showed to pitch the SolarCity acq to his shareholders were non-functioning mockups. He neglected to mention that. Even with California mandating and subsidizing hundreds of millions in a taxpayer giveaway to solar, Musk is about to announce the closure of installation centers all over the country. Employees have already leaked the details. SolarCity added billions of their debt to TSLA and Musk was their largest shareholder at the time, bailing himself out.

I believe this is an SEC violation

The day Musk is handed his just dessert could not come fast enough for the growing number of investors and Musk watchers that have become disenchanted by his erratic and sometimes capricious ways. Not only is the company burning through cash but it is having difficulty producing cars in the numbers and quality they promised. This has resulted in Tesla becoming one of the world’s most-shorted stocks. Unfortunately, for the shorts, shares are up almost 30% in the past month mainly as a result of Musk's antics and toying with those of little faith. More about this in the article below.

Elon Musk May Soon Get His Comeuppance

Elon Musk may soon get his comeuppance for the total arrogance and disregard for what many people think are the rules of the road or common ...

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